Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

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brent
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:43 pm
Location: Raceland, Louisiana

Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby brent » Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:54 pm

Hi everyone,

I am concerned with this raging fire in the Amazon rain forest of Brazil and it's effect on the martins. Do you think it may impact our returning martins? Comments?

Brent

C.C.Martins
Posts: 680
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:15 am
Location: Corpus Christi Tx
Martin Colony History: 2016- didnt know anything about martins, put up an all wrong house in 2016 and had two come by and inspect all the cavities. Left soon after not to return. Learned what i could on PMCA, made adjustments and next year was sucessful.
2017- 5 pair. 15 fledged.
2018-18 pair. 85 fledged.
2019- 17 pair. 81 fledged
Home colony: 12 natural gourds, one modified house. 18 cavities in total.
PMCA member

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby C.C.Martins » Thu Aug 22, 2019 2:23 pm

In short yes. Some times they are seasonal fires, however they practice slash and burn for crops and cattle. Trouble is the soil is poor so they cut and burn more and more. Additionally the president down there is anti-environment (capt chainsaw-his words) recently sacked his environment head. The martins have more to worry about than the gulf migration.
looks like the fires are not engulfing the amazon but if the policies dont change, doesnt look good in the long term. Will it wipe them out? Probably not in our life times. Probably not.
Tom

2016- didnt know anything about martins, put up an all wrong house in 2016 and had two come by and inspect all the cavities. Left soon after not to return. Learned what i could on PMCA, made adjustments and next year was sucessful.
2017- 5 pair. 15 Fledged
2018-18 pairs. 85 Fledged.
2019-17 pair. 81 fledged.
Offering: 12 natural gourds, w/crescents and WDC openings. 6 modified compartment house, crescents with tunnels.

Hanover Bill
Posts: 583
Joined: Thu May 14, 2009 3:10 pm
Location: Pennsylvania/Hanover Township
Martin Colony History: 2009 & 10 - 0
2011 & 12 - Visitors
2013 - 2 pr. fledged 9
2014 - 3 pr. fledged 13
2015 - 7 pr. fledged 27
2016 - 15 pr. fledged 72

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Hanover Bill » Thu Aug 22, 2019 3:24 pm

No lack of things to worry about when you are a Purple Martin Landlord. Add another one to the list with this news. Martins are very adaptable as are all of God's creatures, so hopefully they will navigate this issue as they have many others over the years.

Hanover Bill.
2009 & 10 - 0
2011 & 12 - Visitors
2013 - 2 pr. fledged 9
2014 - 3 pr. fledged 13
2015 - 7 pr. fledged 27
2016 - 15 pr. fledged 72

C.C.Martins
Posts: 680
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:15 am
Location: Corpus Christi Tx
Martin Colony History: 2016- didnt know anything about martins, put up an all wrong house in 2016 and had two come by and inspect all the cavities. Left soon after not to return. Learned what i could on PMCA, made adjustments and next year was sucessful.
2017- 5 pair. 15 fledged.
2018-18 pair. 85 fledged.
2019- 17 pair. 81 fledged
Home colony: 12 natural gourds, one modified house. 18 cavities in total.
PMCA member

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby C.C.Martins » Thu Aug 22, 2019 3:56 pm

Thats true, as a species they are adaptable. Off topic but along the same lines: visited bracken cave north of san antonio to see the biggest mexican free tail bat colony in the world. 20 million or so. They talked conservation and importance of bats and eventually they will buy the land to preserve the area around the cave from developement. Me being me i asked about the mexican side of the boarder for their wintering grounds...he said all bets are off.
Guess we can control what we can.
Tom

2016- didnt know anything about martins, put up an all wrong house in 2016 and had two come by and inspect all the cavities. Left soon after not to return. Learned what i could on PMCA, made adjustments and next year was sucessful.
2017- 5 pair. 15 Fledged
2018-18 pairs. 85 Fledged.
2019-17 pair. 81 fledged.
Offering: 12 natural gourds, w/crescents and WDC openings. 6 modified compartment house, crescents with tunnels.

Lewis
Posts: 209
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 3:21 pm
Location: Georgia/Newnan

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Lewis » Thu Aug 22, 2019 6:04 pm

I think when the PMCA was formed , Mr Hill when ask thought the PM demise would be lack of housing or nesting sites. I read in in Summer Update PMCA is planning a research trip to Brazil. We as protectors of the purple martin must realize that we can not wish this away. We need to with the rest of humankind to do something to stop this destruction of our planet.
Spring Garden Keeper

Chris B
Posts: 358
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:10 pm
Location: AL/Toney

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Chris B » Thu Aug 22, 2019 6:27 pm

I am gonna apologize in advance for this redneck postulate, but what about the trade war with China and our ag products? 540 MILLION acres of rainforest destroyed and naturally fertilized by the burned tree residuals...

These people don't play, nd they have a LOT of people tofeed. And BTW, supply water. Watch the aquafir in neighboring Uruguay if this is true. They get a LOT of water from the Great Lakes now. Then again, they could just pump and bottle from the Canada side.

I sure hope our PMs and the rest of our migratory swallows get by OK. We'll know next year.
2014 8 gourds, 3 pairs nested. Ended w/ 24 total
2015 24 gourds, 22 nests. Lotsa birds!
2016 24 gourds and good activity.
2017 32 SREH gourds. Great activity.
2018 40 SREH gourds. Good finish despite big storm damage. No more dangling gourds.
2019 56+ SREH gourds, all on 3/8 rods.

Lewis
Posts: 209
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 3:21 pm
Location: Georgia/Newnan

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Lewis » Thu Aug 22, 2019 6:45 pm

You may be right in that they need to feed their people, but I believe it's more about the money.
Spring Garden Keeper

brent
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:43 pm
Location: Raceland, Louisiana

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby brent » Thu Aug 22, 2019 7:38 pm

It sure will be interesting to see what our population of PMs is next year. I hope that all goes well for all of our migratory birds from Brazil. I am, without saying, an environmentalist and do what ever I can to protect what God has blessed us with. I do not want to sound political but from what I can see happening in our own country scares me but motivates me to be even more protective of nature. I live in South Louisiana (after living in Florida for 30 years) and I see, first hand, what greed can do to what would otherwise be a true paradise.

Chris B
Posts: 358
Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:10 pm
Location: AL/Toney

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Chris B » Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:05 pm

ALL of us PM fans are environmentalists. Some like me don't buy the MSM media environmental political agenda BS, but watch how many honeybees are on the clover we mow, how the birds and bugs come and go and form our own opinions. So I help the wildlife and I enjoy their presence. Here where I live these birds are a Godsend for the flying insects, and I think the Indians who were PM landlords centuries ago here agreed.

We'll see, but this fire situation in SA looks like environmental hardball over trade/food. The Brazilin people probably have no clue. And as for the migratory bird treaty... well?

Let's cross our fingers and pray.
2014 8 gourds, 3 pairs nested. Ended w/ 24 total
2015 24 gourds, 22 nests. Lotsa birds!
2016 24 gourds and good activity.
2017 32 SREH gourds. Great activity.
2018 40 SREH gourds. Good finish despite big storm damage. No more dangling gourds.
2019 56+ SREH gourds, all on 3/8 rods.

brent
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:43 pm
Location: Raceland, Louisiana

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby brent » Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:41 pm

Agreed. Thanks for a well written reply.

Rafke77
Posts: 132
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2019 9:35 am
Location: Plymouth, IN.
Martin Colony History: 2019 10 pair, 24 fledged.

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Rafke77 » Fri Aug 23, 2019 10:14 am

Just adding this article. I didn't realize there was THAT many fires going on.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-49450495
2019 10 pair, 47 eggs, 24 fledged.

Lewis
Posts: 209
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 3:21 pm
Location: Georgia/Newnan

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Lewis » Fri Aug 23, 2019 5:47 pm

In our lifetime? I am 80 years old and I hope they return to my 32 gourds and house site. I am concerned what will happen to my martins in Brazil. The question I have will be about their food supply. Is it dependent on the rain forest or will they go elsewhere to find food ?
I grew up hunting bob white quail. they were everywhere, any fallow field and even along the cotton field edges. Now there are no wild quail except on managed plantations where they practice conservation. guail need insects to survive. The use of pesticides on cotton , soybeans and peanuts have resulted in no insects for the young quail to eat. This is what worries me about our martins. Will the fires destroy their food supply.
I have read in my farm journals that by 2050 despite all out advances in agriculture we will not be able to feed the world population. So does this mean good by to the Amazon rain forest and our purple martin?

Lewis
Spring Garden Keeper

brent
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:43 pm
Location: Raceland, Louisiana

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby brent » Fri Aug 23, 2019 6:14 pm

Lewis, I am so afraid of this and this is what sparked my posting on the effect of these fires on our martins. We need strong world leaders to press Brazil and other countries about conservation and the effects of climate change as well as using agricultural methods that are earth friendly. I don't know how this will affect our martins but you're right, they need the insects to survive. How will this impact their food supply? I am worried, too. On a smaller scale, I've had to confront my neighbor, not in an aggressive way, but in one that I hope educated him in his use of pesticides in his yard and how it could harm our Blue Birds who depend on eating insects. He replied that he didn't give a @@##!! about the birds. I guess that is where we are. Saddens me.

Andrew Smith
Posts: 20
Joined: Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:11 am
Location: Burford, Ontario, Canada
Martin Colony History: 2019 - Hundreds of fly-bys August and September. Half a dozen birds landed on house.

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Andrew Smith » Sun Aug 25, 2019 6:48 am

So we all have met people who are very close minded with regards to their environment. I live in Ontario, Canada and see it here as well. The best advice I can give is to use you democratic rights. Vote in the politicians that put climate change at the top of their agenda. Sometimes I think people don't realize that if we don't have a healthy planet nothing else will matter. I don't want to get to deep into this topic on the forum but sometimes I look back and wonder how different it would be if someone like Al Gore was elected. Vote for leadership that align with your values, just my two cents.

brent
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:43 pm
Location: Raceland, Louisiana

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby brent » Sun Aug 25, 2019 4:22 pm

You are right on.

4th Gen Martin Fan
Posts: 1272
Joined: Thu Jul 04, 2013 1:19 pm
Location: TN/Collierville
Martin Colony History: I have been exposed to purple martin sounds in utero when my mother went out to get my father away from his martin colony.
I played around the martin colony every summer and watched as my father maintained his colony. In the late 50's until the 70's he did not notice European Starlings in south Texas.
When old enough, I helped maintain his colony. My primary task was eliminating English House Sparrows with a scoped Benjamin .177 pellet rifle.
When I settled into my own home, I started my first colony with an original Trio Castle and Trio Grandpa. When I moved again, I did not put up any martin houses. Frustration with European Starlings in the Southeast US was overwhelming.
Found PMCA Forum and learned about modern enlarged compartments and SREHs.
Inherited my father's last martin house, a Trio Grandma, modified it to modern specifications and have had good results since then.

OT: Lewis Contact Me

Postby 4th Gen Martin Fan » Mon Aug 26, 2019 5:09 pm

Delete
Last edited by 4th Gen Martin Fan on Thu Aug 29, 2019 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Mark.
Firm believer in Enlarged Compartments, SREHs, S&S Control, Pole Predator Guards, Owl/Hawk Guards, Mite/Parasite Control, Housing Insulation, and Vents for Compartment Cooling.
PMCA Member.

Lewis
Posts: 209
Joined: Tue May 26, 2009 3:21 pm
Location: Georgia/Newnan

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Lewis » Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:17 am

I sent you an e-mail to your old address.

Lewis
Spring Garden Keeper

Mitch Booth
Posts: 476
Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2008 6:23 am
Location: Akron, OH
Martin Colony History: 2012 - 0
2013 - 1 pair, 4 eggs, 2 fledged
2014 - 0
2015 - 1 pair, 5 died during week of rain
2016 - 0
2017 - 1 pair, 4 eggs, 4 fledged
2018 - 4 pair, 19 eggs, 19 fledged

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby Mitch Booth » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:11 am

How much of the Amazon (in general) do the martins utilize for over-wintering? I'm not that familiar with Brazil, where I'm guessing, the birds primarily over-winter.

Thanks,

Mitch
2019 -
2018 - 4 pair 19 eggs, 19 fledged
2017 - 1 pair 4 eggs, 4 fledged
2016 - 0 only visits
2015 - 1 pair 5 eggs, 5 hatched, 5 dead on days 6-7
2014 - 0 only visits
2013 - 1 pair 3 eggs, 2 hatched, 2 fledged
2012 - 0

brent
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 2:43 pm
Location: Raceland, Louisiana

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby brent » Wed Aug 28, 2019 6:35 pm

Good question. Any one know?

John Barrow
Posts: 919
Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 4:12 pm
Location: Corpus Christi / Sandia , Texas

Re: Forest fires in Brazil's Amazon rain forest

Postby John Barrow » Wed Aug 28, 2019 7:54 pm

Virtually all of the geolocator/GPS returns of Eastern specie purple martin show returns to the Amazon Basin in northern Brazil. Brazil is a huge country akin in size to the continental U.S. The only return(s) to the southern agricultural areas in Brazil in the Sao Paulo region, where is was suspected purple martins spent the non breeding season, came from a western specie martin tagged in British Columbia.
Purple martins from the eastern species generally occupied from 1-3 roosts spread throughout the Amazon basin, occupying each for a month or two or less. So there is movement throughout the area, though the area is huge.
Linking a scientific article based on geolocator returns which is consistent with later returns. Hope this helps create a vision of where our friends go.

https://www.yorku.ca/bstutch/papers/Fra ... tivity.pdf
~~TEAMED WITH A MARTIN GODDESS~~

Member/Mentor-PMCA. I do regular nestchecks and participate in PROJECT MARTINWATCH!! Coordinated 3 geolocator studies-2009,2010 & 2013. State and Fed licensed bander


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