How do you all do it??

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Roymg
Posts: 118
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:05 pm
Location: Covngton, La

I try and shoot my sparrows. The way I feel is that I'm putting the male sparrow out of his misery. He spends a lot of time with noisy chirps which drive me crazy. He never quits. I did get one of his girl friends but out of 10 shots at him I've had no luck. Sure you feel bad about it but since he can't take a hint that he is not wanted, so be it.

I have this hawk that has taken about 3 of my birds. He is so fast that they never see him coming. He's been around here for several years. I guess you cant kill him or they might put you in jail. I have to go out late evenings and stand by the bird house as they come in. The birds make for their homes in a dive bomb approach wasting no time. They are scared to death of this hawk and it's affected their normal behavior.

I've set up a scarecrow to see if that will help. I spend a lot of time monitoring my birds.
Louise Chambers
Site Admin
Posts: 6208
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2003 1:07 pm
Location: Corpus Christi, TX

Hawks are native birds and protected, you are right. Many landlords do evening patrol, as you are doing, and also put up decoys around the perches, especially on outermost perches - let any hawks go for the 'slow' martins while the real ones get safely into the sky or inside their rooms & gourds.
msalcido
Posts: 254
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:25 pm
Location: Texas/Mineola

kcscriv wrote:I could see you all butchering chickens on the farm, had to chuckle i was thinking of ways you would kill the chickens and cows and hogs, lol. .
- there is NO way that I would be doing that. My grandmother used to get the chickens and wring them by their necks, made my stomach ache just watching! :oops:

John - but that is the only time I have to come in contact. Not while doing the actual deed of breaking it's neck or pushing in the skull! :shock:
What does tail clipping do?

Roymg - I'm about to put up hawk/owl guards. I never have used them but seeing what I did yesterday.... I need to do something to try and protect the martins.
Mike

Fifth season of being a landlord! :) and a PMCA member!
latenightrob
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2014 3:07 pm
Location: WV Moorefield

If you have the extra cash, you could purchase a air rifle like this one used in the video http://tedsholdover.com/fx-bobcat-25-sh ... est-birds/ I do not own this air gun as I don't have the "extra cash" or the "need" as I am a brand new hopeful landlord with zero PMs.

The guy is crazy accurate with this gun and hits sparrows/starlings/pigeons from 100 + yards.

Having said that, I seem to be more understanding/emotional or getting older I don't know exactly how to describe it, but killing anything (minus stink bugs and flies) isn't easy. In my place in NJ I have on any given day a ton of squirrels eating away at my bird seed and eating away at my deck? A few years ago I had the buggers (squirrels) bust into my attic and make a home. That's when my wife gave me the green light to shoot them. Seems crazy but I could take out 3 or 4 squirrels in one day and have more the following day? I am being wordy because we also have a 2nd property in West Virginia that we see next to no squirrels and I would never even think about shooting them there as they are not a nuisance or a need, in fact I built some squirrel houses and put them in the trees.

This year I put up a PM six gourd set up and hope to attract them in WV where I have not even seen a starling or sparrow. I do see them back in town or at the local farms, but not in the woods where I am. (I hope that stays that way!)

Going back to the video he only removes the invasive birds, the ones that cause damage. I hope not to cause any hard feelings, just another way to protect your investment and the safety of your PMs
KathyF
Posts: 3518
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 1:57 pm
Location: Missouri/Licking
Martin Colony History: Colony started - 2007 with one pair
As of 2018 - 84 cavities offered, max # of pairs hosted - 82.

msalcido wrote: What does tail clipping do?
It temporarily disables them from being able to fly up to nest boxes. Until they molt. They regrow wings and tails and next year become more trap-shy so it's harder to trap them.

Check out the article linked here:

http://www.purplemartin.org/main/22.3-H ... wMyths.pdf
"Sometimes", said Pooh, "the smallest things take up the most room in your heart."
2016 - 82 pair
2015 - 76 pair
2014 - 75 pair
2013 - 75 pair
2012-72 pair
http://kathyfreeze.blogspot.com
threelilkids
Posts: 386
Joined: Wed Feb 23, 2011 4:11 pm
Location: Denham Springs, La
Martin Colony History: 2014 1 pair 3 hatched 3 fledged
2015 1 pair 5 hatched 5 fledged
2016 1 pair 5 hatched 4 fledged
2017 2 pair 8 hatched 8 fledged
2018 4 pair 15 hatched

If the thought of putting them down is hard on you than you can bring them to places that use them for food for other animals, much in the same way the hawks do. Snakes will eat them, as I have donated my caught sparrows to facilities that houses animals that need them. Plus you don't have to see them go or do the deed yourself. Just a thought, good luck to all who has to deal with the sparrows and the deed of doing away with them, Mary
msalcido
Posts: 254
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:25 pm
Location: Texas/Mineola

threelilkids wrote:If the thought of putting them down is hard on you than you can bring them to places that use them for food for other animals, much in the same way the hawks do. Snakes will eat them, as I have donated my caught sparrows to facilities that houses animals that need them. Plus you don't have to see them go or do the deed yourself. Just a thought, good luck to all who has to deal with the sparrows and the deed of doing away with them, Mary
- I thought about that Mary. I'm not sure of a place close by to me. I know there is a bird rehabilitation facility somewhere here in TX but not sure exactly how far from me. I need to check them out.

Thanks Kathy. I figured it was the same thing I did with my parakeets to prevent them from leaving the Avery.
Mike

Fifth season of being a landlord! :) and a PMCA member!
birdbrat
Posts: 259
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 3:20 pm
Location: Ohio/SouthSalem

I guess that is why I have so much trouble with killing them in the winter. For some reason, I am able to take care of "the problem" when its nesting time, but in the winter I just tell myself they are trying to survive like everyone else. All that does is create myself a bigger springtime problem. I'm sure we all tell ourselves a lot of things to make ourselves feel better, but when you get right down to it, that seems to be human nature. (to say anything to make ourselves feel better for doing a wrong)
Steve Martin
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:38 am
Location: Tx/Bastrop

kcscriv wrote:I could see you all butchering chickens on the farm, had to chuckle i was thinking of ways you would kill the chickens and cows and hogs, lol.
I think it has a lot to do with, if it was something you grow up with. I was sort of a suburban kid, so I missed all of that. I knew where meat comes from, my mother told me "down in the farm" stories from her childhood. But, I never saw it in person until, I was in my 30's, for me, it was a bit shocking. The lady with the hobby farm had two boys. One Boy about 5/6th grade age would shoot the animals behind the back of the head and the younger was kindergarten age was watching. The younger kid thought it looked funny when the animals were shot. I was kind of horrified. But, I know that a copper hollow point that destroyed the brain would kill the creature without pain and still provide nutritious meat for me to eat.

I thought that the 5th grader could understand what was happening. When I was the 5/6th grade age, I watched predator/prey nature shows. I was I bit puzzled why she let her kindergarten age kid watch, I'm not sure he would understand the reasoning behind why the animals were being killed.

Because they were exposed at a younger age, they will not be squeamish like us city slickers when killing a bird or mammal is required.
msalcido
Posts: 254
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:25 pm
Location: Texas/Mineola

Steve Martin wrote:Because they were exposed at a younger age, they will not be squeamish like us city slickers when killing a bird or mammal is required.
I think you are correct....being exposed to it at a younger age numbs them so they aren't as squeamish. As a kid, I always loved nature (still do) and would have all sorts of pets....fish, hamsters, chickens (in the city), parakeets, etc....each time one would die, I would be quite upset. I'm the same way with the Martins.... :roll:
Mike

Fifth season of being a landlord! :) and a PMCA member!
John Miller
Posts: 4768
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 9:11 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO

Mike

Re: tail clipping. If you use scissors and cut the tail off close to the nub, the sparrow can still fly pretty well but seems to lose interest in returning to the house; maybe knows it can no longer copulate -- literally -- would need a tail to hang on. Whether they live long enough to molt and return is something I'm unsure about. The technique is simply an alternative -- or another tool -- that may be useful to some people and in some narrow situations but is not favored by most here. I have used it on occasion and I'm very glad to be informed about it as an option.

John Miller
msalcido
Posts: 254
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 3:25 pm
Location: Texas/Mineola

John Miller wrote:Mike

Re: tail clipping. If you use scissors and cut the tail off close to the nub, the sparrow can still fly pretty well but seems to lose interest in returning to the house; maybe knows it can no longer copulate -- literally -- would need a tail to hang on. Whether they live long enough to molt and return is something I'm unsure about. The technique is simply an alternative -- or another tool -- that may be useful to some people and in some narrow situations but is not favored by most here. I have used it on occasion and I'm very glad to be informed about it as an option.

John Miller
- Thanks John. I've heard of wing clipping but not tail clipping. I wonder if they are aware they no longer have a tail and can't breed. very interesting.
Mike

Fifth season of being a landlord! :) and a PMCA member!
Steve Martin
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:38 am
Location: Tx/Bastrop

John Miller wrote:I euthanize them immediately in my hand, but have never been absolutely sure of the most effective and easiest technique. Maybe someone can clarify.
When you said easy, did you mean easy as in, "it is easy to avoid mistakes and verify that the euthanasia was done correctly"? Or, did you mean easy in the psychological sense, causing less stress to the person doing the deed? I think cervical dislocation easiest in the first seance, because you can feel the gap in the bird's spinal column just behind the head with your fingers and you will know the dead is done. If you mean easier in the second sense I think chest compression because there is less drama than cervical dislocation.

I've always admired the way constricting snakes kill there prey. It might not be the fastest death, but it usually produces constant results. So on my scale of ethics, I would not consider it a cruel death. I've seen a YouTube video of an accipiter ripping the guts out of a starling for 5 minutes before it died. As much as I hate starlings I was horified. So a half a minute of being constricted seams that is more humane than many natural predators.

Well those are my thoughts.
Last edited by Steve Martin on Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:10 pm, edited 3 times in total.
John Miller
Posts: 4768
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 9:11 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO

Steve

I meant easy in terms of quick and effective in euthanizing the bird and it being obvious. I mostly rely on a quick neck jerk and works well, and I think of it as flipping a switch, and in fact you are severing a circuit.

Chest compression apparently works as I've read that you and many others use it.

This is off track, but I think it helps whenever one engages in sparrow control to understand why. In a nutty shell, the male goes around breaking martin eggs and tossing out young to free up available cavities to increase his chances of attracting a female. Once she's there, he actually settles down, but the cavity they pack is no longer available to martins and they fledge their young in about two weeks and the process starts over. Worse, the sparrow pair attracts more males who see it's a good place to be and that male starts breaking eggs as well.

We should try to trap and shoot, but the worst thing we can do is to pull an active sparrow nest with babies. That turns the male into a maniac and he'll even attack adult martins sometimes, pulling out big patches of feathers with his powerful beak, and sometimes these attacks can even kill adult martins.

Control sparrows , but do so in a systematic, informed way to avoid doing more harm than good. there are many articles here on trapping that are helpful.
John Miller
MamaBruff
Posts: 1466
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:21 pm
Location: SW Missouri
Martin Colony History: 2013-2016 Unsuccessful at starting a PM colony. Health problems.
Rehomed all my PM stuff. Good Luck and Best Wishes to All.

Steve, I think this grisly detail is a little over the top for a public forum.
~Mary B~

Lifelong PM Admirer and Nature Enthusiast.
Ruthless trapper of S&S year round.
2013-2016 Unsuccessful at starting a PM colony. Health problems.
Rehomed all my PM stuff. Good Luck and Best Wishes to All.
Steve Martin
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:38 am
Location: Tx/Bastrop

Sorry if I disturbed anyone. I do feel that this tread was leading in that direction. There have been previous responses iasking about cervical dislocation and chest compression I think this whole topic should have a warning and possibility a more informative name such as "Starling/HOSP control how do you do it?"

The S&S control issue is why I think purplemartin.org should have a separate forum for this subject, and it should be view-able by members only.
Steve Martin
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:38 am
Location: Tx/Bastrop

I was considering my tipping point thread a more of a why would you kill S&S. I was interpreting the title of this thread to mean "how to you preform the action?". Or possibility it could mean, "How can you force yourself to preform the action?". A third possibility could mean, "How do you live with yourself after killing the birds?". I am wrestling with all three in my mind.
Louise Chambers
Site Admin
Posts: 6208
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2003 1:07 pm
Location: Corpus Christi, TX

Some suggestions for humane euthanization here:

http://www.purplemartin.org/update/13.4_Humane.pdf

and with that, perhaps it's time to wrap up this thread for now.
Roymg
Posts: 118
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:05 pm
Location: Covngton, La

msalcido wrote:
kcscriv wrote:I could see you all butchering chickens on the farm, had to chuckle i was thinking of ways you would kill the chickens and cows and hogs, lol. .
- there is NO way that I would be doing that. My grandmother used to get the chickens and wring them by their necks, made my stomach ache just watching! :oops:

John - but that is the only time I have to come in contact. Not while doing the actual deed of breaking it's neck or pushing in the skull! :shock:
What does tail clipping do?

Roymg - I'm about to put up hawk/owl guards. I never have used them but seeing what I did yesterday.... I need to do something to try and protect the martins.
I'm finding the sparrows more irritating to me than the hawk. The little buggers are sharp eyed when they look for me hiding with my gun. So far I've had about 15 shots at this male sparrow with no luck. He now has about three girl friends and they are now looking to move in. I keep them on their toes. They will never nest in this house as long as I have BB's to shoot.
DebA
Posts: 1941
Joined: Tue May 04, 2010 7:43 am
Location: Pratt County/Kansas
Martin Colony History: Start 2009 with one pair. Upgraded from S&K houses to two Trendsetter 12's with gourds beneath in 2013. I have experienced job, pet, and parental losses since '13. The Purple Martins lift my spirits and remind me how life continues forward by flying their little selves from Brazil back to my yard. As one forum person once told me, chin up DebA, look at the martins. Danger all around but yet they soar in the sky without a care in the world.

Oh man. I initially thought your BB's to shoot were Bluebirds. That's the birder abbreviations in me! Or blonde.

Hahaha. Now that would fire this thread up again.

Deb
PMCA MEMBER
Pratt County, Kansas
2016 34 PAIR
2015 27 PAIR
2014 23 PAIR
2013 13 PAIR
2012 6 PAIR
2011 4 PAIR
2010 2 PAIR
2009 1 PAIR
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